Hi all, On Jan 9, 2014, at 8:26 AM, Matt Newville mailto:newville@cars.uchicago.edu> wrote: On Thu, Jan 9, 2014 at 8:04 AM, Bruce Ravel mailto:bravel@bnl.gov> wrote: On 01/09/2014 08:24 AM, Stefano Luciano Ciurli wrote: Hello Bruce and thank you for your hard work! instructions to install on OS X 10.6.8? There is not a Mac package. I do not own a Mac and and so do not have the ability to develop a Mac package on my own. Over the years, no one has ever stepped up to help me develop a Mac package for Demeter. (Or Debian packages, or RedHat packages, for that matter.) Well, I have *tried* many times, and put a fair amount of time in getting Demeter to work on a Mac. What I have not done is *succeed*. I can tell you that getting wxPerl to work on Mac OSX is far from simple. Though Demeter is many years old now, and I've tried many times over the years (and I using wxPython on Mac all the time), it is only within the past few months that I have ever gotten wxPerl to actually build on any Mac, and this was a 10.8 machine. Currently (though I haven't looked at it in more than a month), getting the Ifeffit-Perl interface to build properly with Mac OS 10.8 has me stumped, as Apple is now using llvm/clang, making it challenging to work well with gfortran. Migrating Demeter to use Larch should simplify the situation, as it would remove the need for the Ifeffit-Perl interface. Frankly, the work I do on the Windows package takes a lot of time. The only way I can claim that time fits in my job description is because my group uses Windows machines at our beamlines. Help would be welcome to develop packages for Mac and other platforms, but despite repeated requests over many years, no one has ever volunteered and actually seen it through to completion. Yes, help building Demeter for Mac OSX would be great. I too have put a lot of work into making Demeter run on OS X. I have been attempting to make a port of it in Macports [1] so it is easy to install and/or have a package installer created. The good news is that along the way I have successfully created a port of ifeffit [2] that builds fine for me on 10.9 and should work all the way down to 10.6. I utilize gcc for gfortran. I believe the ifeffit-perl bindings [3] work too. After you install Macports [4], you can simply type: sudo port install p5.16-ifeffit The bad news is that my in progress Demeter port does not work yet. The problem I’m stuck on is getting the perl-wx port [5] built. I have not been able to get it built with the new wx-widgets version 3.0.0 that is in Macports. The perl-wx people apparently don’t have support for that version of wx yet and they never respond to my queries about it on the mailing list. I encourage people to test out ifeffit on OS X through Macports and give me feedback - positive or negative. Thanks to Bruce for his support during this endeavor. Cheers! Frank [1] http://www.macports.org [2] https://trac.macports.org/browser/trunk/dports/science/ifeffit/Portfile [3] https://trac.macports.org/browser/trunk/dports/perl/p5-ifeffit/Portfile [4] http://www.macports.org/install.php [5] https://trac.macports.org/browser/trunk/dports/perl/p5-wx/Portfile

On Jan 9, 2014, at 8:33 PM, Matt Newville wrote:

Hi Frank,

On Thu, Jan 9, 2014 at 10:47 AM, Schima, Frank wrote:

...

Hi all,

On Jan 9, 2014, at 8:26 AM, Matt Newville wrote:

On Thu, Jan 9, 2014 at 8:04 AM, Bruce Ravel wrote:

On 01/09/2014 08:24 AM, Stefano Luciano Ciurli wrote:

Hello Bruce and thank you for your hard work! instructions to install on OS X 10.6.8?

There is not a Mac package. I do not own a Mac and and so do not have the ability to develop a Mac package on my own.

Over the years, no one has ever stepped up to help me develop a Mac package for Demeter. (Or Debian packages, or RedHat packages, for that matter.)

Well, I have *tried* many times, and put a fair amount of time in getting Demeter to work on a Mac. What I have not done is *succeed*. I can tell you that getting wxPerl to work on Mac OSX is far from simple. Though Demeter is many years old now, and I've tried many times over the years (and I using wxPython on Mac all the time), it is only within the past few months that I have ever gotten wxPerl to actually build on any Mac, and this was a 10.8 machine. Currently (though I haven't looked at it in more than a month), getting the Ifeffit-Perl interface to build properly with Mac OS 10.8 has me stumped, as Apple is now using llvm/clang, making it challenging to work well with gfortran.

Migrating Demeter to use Larch should simplify the situation, as it would remove the need for the Ifeffit-Perl interface.

Frankly, the work I do on the Windows package takes a lot of time. The only way I can claim that time fits in my job description is because my group uses Windows machines at our beamlines. Help would be welcome to develop packages for Mac and other platforms, but despite repeated requests over many years, no one has ever volunteered and actually seen it through to completion.

Yes, help building Demeter for Mac OSX would be great.

I too have put a lot of work into making Demeter run on OS X. I have been attempting to make a port of it in Macports [1] so it is easy to install and/or have a package installer created.

The good news is that along the way I have successfully created a port of ifeffit [2] that builds fine for me on 10.9 and should work all the way down to 10.6. I utilize gcc for gfortran. I believe the ifeffit-perl bindings [3] work too. After you install Macports [4], you can simply type:

sudo port install p5.16-ifeffit

The bad news is that my in progress Demeter port does not work yet. The problem I’m stuck on is getting the perl-wx port [5] built. I have not been able to get it built with the new wx-widgets version 3.0.0 that is in Macports. The perl-wx people apparently don’t have support for that version of wx yet and they never respond to my queries about it on the mailing list.

I encourage people to test out ifeffit on OS X through Macports and give me feedback - positive or negative. Thanks to Bruce for his support during this endeavor.

Cheers! Frank

[1] http://www.macports.org [2] https://trac.macports.org/browser/trunk/dports/science/ifeffit/Portfile [3] https://trac.macports.org/browser/trunk/dports/perl/p5-ifeffit/Portfile [4] http://www.macports.org/install.php [5] https://trac.macports.org/browser/trunk/dports/perl/p5-wx/Portfile

Thanks! I'm very glad you're working on this too.

I wasn't able to build wxPerl with macports either, but it did work with citrusperl. I don't have a strong preference, but citrusperl does seem reasonable as a "standalone perl install". I don't know how likely it wold be to package this up into an App, but I suspect it would be possible.

I don’t know anything about citrusperl - besides the 1 minute of looking at the site since you mentioned it - but I’m working on a Macports based solution to install Demeter and so I will be using perl from Macports only. I feel that is the best way forward and where my knowledge lies.

FWIW, I think that Demeter does not need wxWidgets verision 3, and that 2.8 or 2.9 would be fine.... From recent experience with wxPython and wxWidgets 3, I'd take the conservative approach and see if Demeter can work with a not-too-old version like 2.9. Does that help you build with macports?

It used to build for me, I think with wxWidgets 2.9. But for reasons that I’ve now forgotten, Demeter did not completely run correctly when I built it. I believe one of the sub programs did work for me however. But now that wxWidgets has been updated in Macports to version 3, the perl-wx project has apparently not been updated to accommodate this new version yet. wxWidgets has been a major problem in Macports because it was 32-bit code and not 64-bit ready. My understanding is that version 3.0 is 64-bit finally. This is the desired state that will allow it to work better with OS X and Macports in general.

And I have been able to build the Ifeffit-Perl bindings on 10.6, but not on 10.8. I assumed this is due to changes in the Fortran compilers. On one 10.8 machine, I know that I tried one of the 3rd party ports of GFortran from http://hpc.sourceforge.net/ It's certainly possible that I'm doing something wrong. I haven't looked at this in detail since November, but will give it another got over the next couple weeks.

The p5.16-ifeffit port should build just fine on 10.8.

Of course, my preference would be to move away from the ifeffit library to Larch, and this definitely works on Macs (and I know I can make Apps), but it would be good to get some version of Demeter working.

I’m open to this. There is currently no port in Macports for Larch. That would be the first step. Do you think it would be useful? Perhaps we can work on this offline. Feel free to email me directly about that. Cheers! Frank

I can concur with others here that making something work on Mac can be a miserable experience. Sometimes you have to admit defeat and change the approach. Anyway, I tried "sudo port install p5.16-ifeffit" and failed: ~/Downloads% sudo port install p5.16-ifeffit ---> Computing dependencies for p5.16-ifeffit ---> Dependencies to be installed: ifeffit pgplot perl5.16 gdbm ---> Extracting pgplot Error: org.macports.extract for port pgplot returned: command execution failed Error: Failed to install pgplot Please see the log file for port pgplot for details: /opt/local/var/macports/logs/_opt_local_var_macports_sources_rsync.macports.org_release_tarballs_ports_graphics_pgplot/pgplot/main.log Error: The following dependencies were not installed: ifeffit pgplot perl5.16 gdbm To report a bug, follow the instructions in the guide: http://guide.macports.org/#project.tickets Error: Processing of port p5.16-ifeffit failed ~/Downloads% (This is upon rerunning the command - the first time, it installed many more dependencies -- does anyone else suspect "port" of being designed to fill hard disks as fast as possible?) System is 10.9 generally up-to-date with most things. pgplot seems to fail during extraction. I doubt that I'd be able to contribute a lot to this project, but I can test things. Also I'm surprised to read so much about gfortran about this thread, but maybe I'm missing some common knowledge on the project ... I am generally much happier with Ifort. Cheers, Kevin On Thu, Jan 9, 2014 at 8:47 AM, Schima, Frank wrote:

Hi all,

On Jan 9, 2014, at 8:26 AM, Matt Newville wrote:

On Thu, Jan 9, 2014 at 8:04 AM, Bruce Ravel wrote:

On 01/09/2014 08:24 AM, Stefano Luciano Ciurli wrote:

Hello Bruce and thank you for your hard work! instructions to install on OS X 10.6.8?

There is not a Mac package. I do not own a Mac and and so do not have the ability to develop a Mac package on my own.

Over the years, no one has ever stepped up to help me develop a Mac package for Demeter. (Or Debian packages, or RedHat packages, for that matter.)

Well, I have *tried* many times, and put a fair amount of time in getting Demeter to work on a Mac. What I have not done is *succeed*. I can tell you that getting wxPerl to work on Mac OSX is far from simple. Though Demeter is many years old now, and I've tried many times over the years (and I using wxPython on Mac all the time), it is only within the past few months that I have ever gotten wxPerl to actually build on any Mac, and this was a 10.8 machine. Currently (though I haven't looked at it in more than a month), getting the Ifeffit-Perl interface to build properly with Mac OS 10.8 has me stumped, as Apple is now using llvm/clang, making it challenging to work well with gfortran.

Migrating Demeter to use Larch should simplify the situation, as it would remove the need for the Ifeffit-Perl interface.

Frankly, the work I do on the Windows package takes a lot of time. The only way I can claim that time fits in my job description is because my group uses Windows machines at our beamlines. Help would be welcome to develop packages for Mac and other platforms, but despite repeated requests over many years, no one has ever volunteered and actually seen it through to completion.

Yes, help building Demeter for Mac OSX would be great.

I too have put a lot of work into making Demeter run on OS X. I have been attempting to make a port of it in Macports [1] so it is easy to install and/or have a package installer created.

The good news is that along the way I have successfully created a port of ifeffit [2] that builds fine for me on 10.9 and should work all the way down to 10.6. I utilize gcc for gfortran. I believe the ifeffit-perl bindings [3] work too. After you install Macports [4], you can simply type:

sudo port install p5.16-ifeffit

The bad news is that my in progress Demeter port does not work yet. The problem I’m stuck on is getting the perl-wx port [5] built. I have not been able to get it built with the new wx-widgets version 3.0.0 that is in Macports. The perl-wx people apparently don’t have support for that version of wx yet and they never respond to my queries about it on the mailing list.

I encourage people to test out ifeffit on OS X through Macports and give me feedback - positive or negative. Thanks to Bruce for his support during this endeavor.

Cheers! Frank

[1] http://www.macports.org [2] < https://trac.macports.org/browser/trunk/dports/science/ifeffit/Portfile> [3] < https://trac.macports.org/browser/trunk/dports/perl/p5-ifeffit/Portfile> [4] http://www.macports.org/install.php [5] https://trac.macports.org/browser/trunk/dports/perl/p5-wx/Portfile

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Hi Matt, I agree with everything you say. Thanks for taking the time to explain. As someone who uses fortran all the time, it makes sense for me to own Ifort, but since it's only free for academics on Linux, that's not true for most people. Actually, for FEFF our philosophy is also that it should compile with any compiler on any platform. We respond to EVERY compilation issue and never tell people to use another compiler. However -- most of our users don't want to compile code at all: they like a nice binary that I've compiled for them. (I doubt that the ifeffit/demeter users would object to this option ;).) For that, I like to use Ifort - for my purpose it's the better compiler. But we make sure that FEFF compiles well using gfortran etc. also. If I were to successfully built the codes on this mailing list, I'll definitely share the recipe, as well as any kind of binary other people can use without having to build/compile/... . It won't be for today, unfortunately :). Cheers, Kevin On Fri, Jan 10, 2014 at 7:28 AM, Matt Newville wrote:

Hi Kevin,

On Thu, Jan 9, 2014 at 11:37 PM, Kevin Jorissen wrote:

...

I can concur with others here that making something work on Mac can be a miserable experience. Sometimes you have to admit defeat and change the approach.

Anyway, I tried "sudo port install p5.16-ifeffit" and failed:

~/Downloads% sudo port install p5.16-ifeffit ---> Computing dependencies for p5.16-ifeffit

---> Dependencies to be installed: ifeffit pgplot perl5.16 gdbm

---> Extracting pgplot

Error: org.macports.extract for port pgplot returned: command execution failed

Error: Failed to install pgplot

Please see the log file for port pgplot for details:

/opt/local/var/macports/logs/_opt_local_var_macports_sources_rsync.macports.org_release_tarballs_ports_graphics_pgplot/pgplot/main.log

...

Error: The following dependencies were not installed: ifeffit pgplot perl5.16 gdbm

To report a bug, follow the instructions in the guide:

http://guide.macports.org/#project.tickets

Error: Processing of port p5.16-ifeffit failed

~/Downloads%

(This is upon rerunning the command - the first time, it installed many

more

...

dependencies -- does anyone else suspect "port" of being designed to fill hard disks as fast as possible?) System is 10.9 generally up-to-date with most things. pgplot seems to fail during extraction.

I doubt that I'd be able to contribute a lot to this project, but I can test things.

Also I'm surprised to read so much about gfortran about this thread, but maybe I'm missing some common knowledge on the project ... I am generally much happier with Ifort.

If you or anyone else wants to use ifort or any other compiler, that would be fine. For many years, I did keep a license for Digital/Compaq/Intel Fortran on Windows in order to make the Windows dlls for distribution of the Ifeffit package. Even on Windows, this stopped being necessary, as the MinGW suite began including gfortran.

Unlike Feff, these are open source projects, and we absolutely insist that anyone interested can use, (try to) build, and distribute these programs -- both Bruce and I are begging for such help, actually. Requiring non-free tools simply to build these programs would definitely put a burden on potential developers. I don't see any reason for why that would be necessary, especially on Linux and Mac, for which the system compilers are gcc (or gcc/llvm) which includes a working fortran compiler.

Many free software projects (notably for me, scipy, but also the macports that Frank mentioned) use gfortran on Macs. And gfortran works fine for me for many things on 10.6 and 10.8. I can compile the basic ifeffit library and other fortran libraries used in Larch (though I did recently notice some dependency issues between 10.6 and 10.8, as the compiler version changed, and haven't tried 10.9 yet). I have not been able to build PGPLOT (perhaps not crucial for Demeter) or the Ifeffit-Perl bridge successfully on 10.8. I believe this is probably a matter of getting the compiler / linker arguments correct....

If you or anyone else can get these codes to build using ifort, more power to you. If so, can you post your solution?

--Matt _______________________________________________ Ifeffit mailing list Ifeffit@millenia.cars.aps.anl.gov http://millenia.cars.aps.anl.gov/mailman/listinfo/ifeffit

Hi Frank, thanks for responding ... I merely wanted to do you the favor of giving feedback on an experimental solution you solicited feedback for. After wiping and reinstalling macports, your port also installs. I probably don't want to know why. Cheers, Kevin On Fri, Jan 10, 2014 at 10:43 AM, Schima, Frank wrote:

On Jan 9, 2014, at 10:37 PM, Kevin Jorissen wrote:

I can concur with others here that making something work on Mac can be a miserable experience.

That’s the opposite of my experience.

Anyway, I tried "sudo port install p5.16-ifeffit" and failed: ~/Downloads% sudo port install p5.16-ifeffit ---> Computing dependencies for p5.16-ifeffit ---> Dependencies to be installed: ifeffit pgplot perl5.16 gdbm ---> Extracting pgplot Error: org.macports.extract for port pgplot returned: command execution failed Error: Failed to install pgplot Please see the log file for port pgplot for details:

/opt/local/var/macports/logs/_opt_local_var_macports_sources_rsync.macports.org_release_tarballs_ports_graphics_pgplot/pgplot/main.log Error: The following dependencies were not installed: ifeffit pgplot perl5.16 gdbm To report a bug, follow the instructions in the guide: http://guide.macports.org/#project.tickets Error: Processing of port p5.16-ifeffit failed ~/Downloads%

(This is upon rerunning the command - the first time, it installed many more dependencies -- does anyone else suspect "port" of being designed to fill hard disks as fast as possible?) System is 10.9 generally up-to-date with most things. pgplot seems to fail during extraction.

The pgplot port extracts and installs fine for me on OS X (10.6 through 10.9). But this is completely off-topic for this list. Please go to the Macports users mailing list [1] for support about this issue.

I doubt that I'd be able to contribute a lot to this project, but I can test things.

That is helpful.

Also I'm surprised to read so much about gfortran about this thread, but maybe I'm missing some common knowledge on the project ... I am generally much happier with Ifort.

gfortran is the only fortran compiler that will work with Macports since it is open source.

Cheers! Frank

[1] https://lists.macosforge.org/mailman/listinfo/macports-users

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