Re: [Ifeffit] Getting started in OS X...
Hello, I just wanted to echo Scott's sentiments. If someone has the time and energy to create for the Mac an executable version of the Artemis/Athena/IFEFFIT programs (and keep them updated), I'd also be very grateful. Being unfamiliar with Unix, I experienced the same problems as Scott in trying to get the programs up and running on my Mac. So, I bought a PC laptop specifically for doing data analysis with these very nice programs. Dean Hesterberg ************************************************** Hi again,
OK, I've reached a conclusion. For someone not currently using the open source UNIX tools and the like on the Mac, the project of getting Artemis, Athena, and IFEFFIT up and running is immense, because it means getting a large amount of additional infrastructure in place. Consider: Fink is required. Once Fink is installed, the x-free87-base package is required. That package, in turn, requires downloading 12 separate files (one-by-one, as far as I can tell). And that's just one part of a part of what is required (g77, pgplot, perl...). My estimate is that, with my lack of experience, it would take me a week full-time to get all this stuff working right. That's not a problem, of course, for people who already do development on the Mac and have most of this stuff set up anyway, or at least find uses for it other than getting the EXAFS packages to run. But it's too much of a time investment for me, and I suspect that the same is true for a lot of others in the field.
So I'm going to scrounge a pc from somewhere, transfer my data files
from the Mac, and download the executable there.
If at some point an executable appears for the Mac, I will thank the authors profusely...I realize that no one is getting paid to work on this!
--Scott Calvin Naval Research Lab Code 6344 _______________________________________________ Ifeffit mailing list Ifeffit@millenia.cars.aps.anl.gov http://millenia.cars.aps.anl.gov/mailman/listinfo/ifeffit
------------------------------------------------------ DEAN HESTERBERG Associate Professor Department of Soil Science College of Agriculture and Life Sciences North Carolina State University Box 7619 (3235 Williams Hall) Raleigh, NC 27695-7619 E-mail: dean_hesterberg@ncsu.edu FAX: (919) 515-2167 tel: (919) 513-3035
OK--welcome me to the wonderful world of IFEFFIT/ATHENA/ARTEMIS! I've got them running by using Virtual PC to run the Windows installer... --Scott
It is not all *that* difficult to get things running on the Macintosh. The main problem from my perspective is keeping things up-to-date. I could make a binary installer (it is not really that hard), but there are probably several hundred files that need to be installed and keeping this working long term sounds like a potentially time consuming project. I was thinking of a two part installation process: 1. install the apple developer CD contents (included with 10.2) 2. download from www.apple.com, Apple's installer for X11 (binary installer) 3. install the fink binary installer 4. (on the command line) type "fink install horae" If I follow up on this (I was hoping to talk to Matt and Bruce about this at XAFS 12), all I would have to maintain is a file that tells your computer how to compile horae and ifeffit -- this is easy as I already do it on my Mac myself. Within fink (an installation package manager that connects to a remote server for the latest versions automagically), I could ensure that all of the packages are compatible with each other, and that the latest versions are being used. fink would automatically install a fortran compiler (useful for other things too) as well as all of the latest versions of the relevant libraries (e.g. pgplot, python) all with the input show on line four above. My main worry about a binary installer is that since *I* am using fink for many items, if I *were* to make a binary installer, I might very well clobber (overwrite) part of a horae users fink installation. This is bad in two ways. The binary install might very well destroy the users fink installation and since the fink database (with a binary installer) wouldn't know anything about my files, running fink might very well destroy horae/ifeffit. If there is enough interest, I might give it a shot, but this would be only for people who don't use fink. Any thoughts? Paul Fons, Ph.D. Senior Staff Researcher Photonics Institute National Institute for Advanced Industrial Science & Technology Tsukuba, JAPAN 305-8568 email: paul-fons@aist.go.jp tel. +81-298-61-5636 fax: +81-298-61-5615 The lines below are in Japanese 主任研究官 ポール・フォンス 産業技術総合研究所 光技術研究部門 つくば市茨城県 305-8568
Hi all, It's decision time for me. I'm starting a new faculty position, and need to decide ASAP whether I'm going Mac or Windows. While my preference is Mac, I'm not going to choose that for me and any undergrads who end up working with me without knowing that there will be in the near future an Artemis/Athena/IFeffit installer that allows students to easily install this software on their own systems. Is anyone planning to do this soon, or do I go with Windows? --Scott Calvin Sarah Lawrence College
Scott: There is a third alternative. I have been building Debian/GNU Linux packages of all of these programs and they are available for use by anyone. Carlo On Tue, 22 Jul 2003, Scott Calvin wrote:
Hi all,
It's decision time for me. I'm starting a new faculty position, and need to decide ASAP whether I'm going Mac or Windows. While my preference is Mac, I'm not going to choose that for me and any undergrads who end up working with me without knowing that there will be in the near future an Artemis/Athena/IFeffit installer that allows students to easily install this software on their own systems.
Is anyone planning to do this soon, or do I go with Windows?
--Scott Calvin Sarah Lawrence College _______________________________________________ Ifeffit mailing list Ifeffit@millenia.cars.aps.anl.gov http://millenia.cars.aps.anl.gov/mailman/listinfo/ifeffit
-- Carlo U. Segre -- Professor of Physics Associate Dean for Special Projects, Graduate College Illinois Institute of Technology Voice: 312.567.3498 Fax: 312.567.3494 Carlo.Segre@iit.edu http://www.iit.edu/~segre
Hi Carlo, On Tue, 22 Jul 2003, Carlo U. Segre wrote:
There is a third alternative. I have been building Debian/GNU Linux packages of all of these programs and they are available for use by anyone.
Sorry to be so dense, but where are these again? I looked briedly at the CSSRI and MRCAT web pages, but must have missed them. Can I add a link to these from the ifeffit pages? I agree that these could be a great help to many people (linux and Mac), and it's probably the right way to make a sustainable Mac OS X installer for ifeffit+athena+artemis+.... Thanks! --Matt
Matt: I have three apt-archives for the source and the stable and testing distributions. The appropriate magic is: # for Debian stable deb http://fermi.phys.iit.edu/debian/woody binary/ # for Debian testing deb http://fermi.phys.iit.edu/debian/sarge binary/ # sources used to build packages deb-src http://fermi.phys.iit.edu/debian source/ These are by no means clean Debian packages. I have not yet packages the python wrappers for ifeffit (hopefully soon) and there is a conflict in horae with the FBox.pm perl module in the stock Debian perl-tk packages that forced me to use the one distributed in horae. This leads to a conflict the first time horae is installed (you can force installation though and then all is fine until the next time perl-tk is upgraded, then it becomes necessary to uninstall horae and reinstall it to get the correct version of FBox.pm). Outside of these two issues, the packages seem to do their job. Carlo On Tue, 22 Jul 2003, Matt Newville wrote:
Hi Carlo,
On Tue, 22 Jul 2003, Carlo U. Segre wrote:
There is a third alternative. I have been building Debian/GNU Linux packages of all of these programs and they are available for use by anyone.
Sorry to be so dense, but where are these again? I looked briedly at the CSSRI and MRCAT web pages, but must have missed them. Can I add a link to these from the ifeffit pages?
I agree that these could be a great help to many people (linux and Mac), and it's probably the right way to make a sustainable Mac OS X installer for ifeffit+athena+artemis+....
Thanks!
--Matt
_______________________________________________ Ifeffit mailing list Ifeffit@millenia.cars.aps.anl.gov http://millenia.cars.aps.anl.gov/mailman/listinfo/ifeffit
-- Carlo U. Segre -- Professor of Physics Associate Dean for Special Projects, Graduate College Illinois Institute of Technology Voice: 312.567.3498 Fax: 312.567.3494 segre@agni.phys.iit.edu http://www.iit.edu/~segre
I am also thinking of making an OS X binary installer (for those who don't want to deal with fink etc.). The installer would be for installation on a generic Mac OS 10.2.x system and would include ifeffit, athena, artemis, tkatoms, and the necessary libraries. All of this would be in effect, just copying over the necessary binaries with only a minimal check for safety. The other option is fink which would allow the use of potentially binary installations and/or compilation. The compilation step would require people to install the (free) C compiler from Apple. Any one else interested in using or helping with such a project?
Paul, I can/want2 help despite I tend to think that these series of great software are a nightmare to install as compared to all others. I've experienced many times that makefiles poorly work in general from one computer to another (same platform). I guess this is more time consuming for developers and direct compilation would be much more efficient. So making binaries for everybody is what every software people do, otherwise it is very discouraging because 99% of the people don't care for unix, windows and makefiles as we have tons of exafs data to reduce (and handy and very powerful software also exist on the market). all the best, Francois- -- Francois FARGES Laboratoire des Géomatériaux Université de Marne la Vallée 5 Bd Descartes-Champs S/Marne 77454 Marne la Vallée cedex 2 TEL: 01 49 32 90 57 from outside France: +33 1 49 32 90 57 FAX: 01 49 32 91 37 from outside France: +33 1 49 32 91 37
Hi Paul, I can make an installer in about 10 minutes if you send me a tar file with all the athena artemis atoms and libraries. Jeff On Wednesday, July 23, 2003, at 12:52 AM, Paul Fons wrote:
I am also thinking of making an OS X binary installer (for those who don't want to deal with fink etc.). The installer would be for installation on a generic Mac OS 10.2.x system and would include ifeffit, athena, artemis, tkatoms, and the necessary libraries. All of this would be in effect, just copying over the necessary binaries with only a minimal check for safety. The other option is fink which would allow the use of potentially binary installations and/or compilation. The compilation step would require people to install the (free) C compiler from Apple. Any one else interested in using or helping with such a project?
_______________________________________________ Ifeffit mailing list Ifeffit@millenia.cars.aps.anl.gov http://millenia.cars.aps.anl.gov/mailman/listinfo/ifeffit
Thanks for the help offer. I might even take you up on it in the (hopefully) near future. My current installation of athena, artemis, etc. is built using my manually installed perl 5.8.0 which is not compatible with the standard perl 5.6 that apple provides. I will have to build a new installation to make things more compatible. Then making a tar file will be a lot easier. Of course, the libraries required will span several different locations, namely /Library/Perl, /sw/lib, and /usr/local/bin among others. It would also be nice to put up a warning on the install telling people that it will install stuff into fink's space without telling fink about it (hence I want to make a fink based installation possible as well). Paul On 2003.Jul.23, at 10:28 PM, Jeff Terry wrote:
Hi Paul,
I can make an installer in about 10 minutes if you send me a tar file with all the athena artemis atoms and libraries.
Jeff
On Wednesday, July 23, 2003, at 12:52 AM, Paul Fons wrote:
I am also thinking of making an OS X binary installer (for those who don't want to deal with fink etc.). The installer would be for installation on a generic Mac OS 10.2.x system and would include ifeffit, athena, artemis, tkatoms, and the necessary libraries. All of this would be in effect, just copying over the necessary binaries with only a minimal check for safety. The other option is fink which would allow the use of potentially binary installations and/or compilation. The compilation step would require people to install the (free) C compiler from Apple. Any one else interested in using or helping with such a project?
_______________________________________________ Ifeffit mailing list Ifeffit@millenia.cars.aps.anl.gov http://millenia.cars.aps.anl.gov/mailman/listinfo/ifeffit
_______________________________________________ Ifeffit mailing list Ifeffit@millenia.cars.aps.anl.gov http://millenia.cars.aps.anl.gov/mailman/listinfo/ifeffit
Paul Fons, Ph.D. Senior Staff Researcher Photonics Institute National Institute for Advanced Industrial Science & Technology Umezono 1-1-1 Tsukuba Central 2 Tsukuba, JAPAN 305-8568 email: paul-fons@aist.go.jp tel. +81-298-61-5636 fax: +81-298-61-5615 The lines below are in Japanese 主任研究官 ポール・フォンス 産業技術総合研究所 光技術研究部門 つくば市茨城県 305-8568
As I understand it, fink is very similar to the Debian packaging system. Perhaps the Debian sources that i have made and will continue to support will help speed up the process. Carlo On Wed, 23 Jul 2003, Paul Fons wrote:
I am also thinking of making an OS X binary installer (for those who don't want to deal with fink etc.). The installer would be for installation on a generic Mac OS 10.2.x system and would include ifeffit, athena, artemis, tkatoms, and the necessary libraries. All of this would be in effect, just copying over the necessary binaries with only a minimal check for safety. The other option is fink which would allow the use of potentially binary installations and/or compilation. The compilation step would require people to install the (free) C compiler from Apple. Any one else interested in using or helping with such a project?
-- Carlo U. Segre -- Professor of Physics Associate Dean for Special Projects, Graduate College Illinois Institute of Technology Voice: 312.567.3498 Fax: 312.567.3494 Carlo.Segre@iit.edu http://www.iit.edu/~segre
I think they are in principle very similar. The idea of using fink is that I can leverage off the packages that are already in fink, namely perlTk, readline, libpng, python, and so on. This would make a binary install via fink possible in the future. Right now, I have a non-standard system that includes my own perlTk (from source) and perl 5.8.0 (manually installed) so I need to clean up a new partition for a test. I am still interested in your experiences. Paul On 2003.Jul.24, at 12:39 AM, Carlo U. Segre wrote:
As I understand it, fink is very similar to the Debian packaging system. Perhaps the Debian sources that i have made and will continue to support will help speed up the process.
Carlo
On Wed, 23 Jul 2003, Paul Fons wrote:
I am also thinking of making an OS X binary installer (for those who don't want to deal with fink etc.). The installer would be for installation on a generic Mac OS 10.2.x system and would include ifeffit, athena, artemis, tkatoms, and the necessary libraries. All of this would be in effect, just copying over the necessary binaries with only a minimal check for safety. The other option is fink which would allow the use of potentially binary installations and/or compilation. The compilation step would require people to install the (free) C compiler from Apple. Any one else interested in using or helping with such a project?
-- Carlo U. Segre -- Professor of Physics Associate Dean for Special Projects, Graduate College Illinois Institute of Technology Voice: 312.567.3498 Fax: 312.567.3494 Carlo.Segre@iit.edu http://www.iit.edu/~segre
_______________________________________________ Ifeffit mailing list Ifeffit@millenia.cars.aps.anl.gov http://millenia.cars.aps.anl.gov/mailman/listinfo/ifeffit
Paul Fons, Ph.D. Senior Staff Researcher Photonics Institute National Institute for Advanced Industrial Science & Technology Umezono 1-1-1 Tsukuba Central 2 Tsukuba, JAPAN 305-8568 email: paul-fons@aist.go.jp tel. +81-298-61-5636 fax: +81-298-61-5615 The lines below are in Japanese 主任研究官 ポール・フォンス 産業技術総合研究所 光技術研究部門 つくば市茨城県 305-8568
Scott, I will gladly make an up-to-date ifeffit installer for you. I just recompiled the new version today. I also have a launcher for the dock that will launch all of the artemis athena atoms from the dock. I just don't use artemis and athena though. I wrote the launcher many versions ago, anybody that wants it can drop me an email. Because I don't use artemis and athena, I don't have a version of these that I can make a launcher out of. If python is to be well supported in panther as the rumor mill suggests, maybe I will change my mind. Jeff On Tuesday, July 22, 2003, at 05:18 PM, Scott Calvin wrote:
Hi all,
It's decision time for me. I'm starting a new faculty position, and need to decide ASAP whether I'm going Mac or Windows. While my preference is Mac, I'm not going to choose that for me and any undergrads who end up working with me without knowing that there will be in the near future an Artemis/Athena/IFeffit installer that allows students to easily install this software on their own systems.
Is anyone planning to do this soon, or do I go with Windows?
--Scott Calvin Sarah Lawrence College _______________________________________________ Ifeffit mailing list Ifeffit@millenia.cars.aps.anl.gov http://millenia.cars.aps.anl.gov/mailman/listinfo/ifeffit
Oops, I guess artemis and athena are perl not python. Jeff On Tuesday, July 22, 2003, at 06:56 PM, Jeff Terry wrote:
Scott,
I will gladly make an up-to-date ifeffit installer for you. I just recompiled the new version today.
I also have a launcher for the dock that will launch all of the artemis athena atoms from the dock.
I just don't use artemis and athena though. I wrote the launcher many versions ago, anybody that wants it
can drop me an email.
Because I don't use artemis and athena, I don't have a version of these that I can make a launcher out of.
If python is to be well supported in panther as the rumor mill suggests, maybe I will change my mind.
Jeff
On Tuesday, July 22, 2003, at 05:18 PM, Scott Calvin wrote:
Hi all,
It's decision time for me. I'm starting a new faculty position, and need to decide ASAP whether I'm going Mac or Windows. While my preference is Mac, I'm not going to choose that for me and any undergrads who end up working with me without knowing that there will be in the near future an Artemis/Athena/IFeffit installer that allows students to easily install this software on their own systems.
Is anyone planning to do this soon, or do I go with Windows?
--Scott Calvin Sarah Lawrence College _______________________________________________ Ifeffit mailing list Ifeffit@millenia.cars.aps.anl.gov http://millenia.cars.aps.anl.gov/mailman/listinfo/ifeffit
_______________________________________________ Ifeffit mailing list Ifeffit@millenia.cars.aps.anl.gov http://millenia.cars.aps.anl.gov/mailman/listinfo/ifeffit
participants (7)
-
Carlo U. Segre -
dean_hesterberg＠ncsu.edu -
Francois Farges -
Jeff Terry -
Matt Newville -
Paul Fons -
Scott Calvin