Re: [Ifeffit] Cumulant expansion fittings

Matt, it is a very nice explanation. Another way to think about the triangle inequality effect is to imagine a snapshot at the framework of atomic bonds in solid where they are all distorted from the underlying crystallographic lattice due to thermal vibrations. Imagine then N successive (100) planes (using cubic unit cell, for example) and compare the distance between the 1st and the Nth plane with the length of the polyline connecting the bonds that buckle along this distance in such a snapshot. Each polyline from each snapshot is longer than the straight line (Pythagorus theorem), and thus the time-average of the polyline is longer than the straight line. Then, divide the two of them (the time-average of the polyline length and the time-average of the spacing between the 1st and the Nth plane) by N and you will obtain the same result as in your email: the bond length measured by XAFS is longer than that "measured" by XRD, and more so the greater buclking (i.e., due to temperature or alloying). It is because XRD does not measure bond length but only the interplanar spacing. Anatoly ________________________________ From: ifeffit-bounces@millenia.cars.aps.anl.gov on behalf of Matt Newville Sent: Fri 1/23/2009 5:24 PM To: XAFS Analysis using Ifeffit Subject: Re: [Ifeffit] Cumulant expansion fittings Sorry this is so long, and I certainly believe that everyone in this conversation understands these issues well. But I do think that there is confusion in the literature (not Fornasini's work) and so some potential for confusion for novices too. Ignoring 3 body correlations probed by multiple scattering, XAFS is sensitive only to R, the distance between the absorbing atom and scattering atom. R is a scalar, not a vector: it has no direction, it is only length. There is no such thing as "parallel to R" or "perpendicular to R". Bond direction only becomes a useful idea when you include a third atom (or more, say a whole crystal lattice). Single Scattering XAFS is not sensitive to this third (or more) atom, and is not sensitive to any changes in the relative orientation of the two atoms to the rest of the system. XAFS samples a distribution of distances, g(R). sigma^2 is second moment of g(R). There are no directional component to <R>, sigma^2, or other moments/cumulants of g(R). If you imagine a central atom fixed in space and a neighboring atom that has a fixed distance from it but can rotate freely about that atom on a spherical shell, XAFS will see no disorder: sigma^2 will be zero. This closely describes an organic ligand for a molecule in solution. The molecule can tumble and rotate and take any orientation relative to the lab frame (or x-ray polarization vector) but the interatomic distance is well defined, and there will be a strong XAFS signal with a relatively small sigma^2. XAFS is sensitive only to displacements in R. I generally like Fornasini's work, and agree with the basic physics (well, maybe it's geometry) of the result John cites, but I might use different notation and terms. I would point out that they use "u^2_perp" and "u^2_parallel", and that the diffraction values DO have directionality, while sigma^2 does not. The general topic here is "how can one relate XAFS values for R and sigma2 to diffraction results for spacing between lattice planes and points"?, part of a recurring theme in the literature to relate temperature dependent changes in XAFS R to thermal expansion coefficients measured as bulk properties of materials or as the temperature dependence of the distance between lattice planes as measured by diffraction. Imagine two lattice points separated by a distance L, and two atoms vibrating isotropically around each lattice point, such that the average position is exactly at the lattice point, but that it samples off-lattice points with some Gaussian distribution. Assume that the displacements of the two atoms are completely uncorrelated. That is, you have two fuzzy little distributions for atoms around fixed lattice points: O -- O 1 2 Consider a snapshot with atom 1 displaced "up" (+y direction) from it's lattice point by distance d, and atom 2 displaced by the same distance: Atom2 sign of (R-L) R^2 center + L^2 + d^2 up (+y) 0 L^2 down (-y) + L^2 + (2d)^2 right (+x) + (L+d)^2 + d^2 left (-x) - (L-d)^2 + d^2 in (+z) + L^2 + 2 * d^2 out (-z) + L^2 + 2 * d^2 If these are sampled uniformly, the average R is greater than L. Considering all the displacements for atom 1, you'll have something like <R> ~= L + /2R This is just due to the triangle inequality, and is basically the result Fornasini et al give. It means that the <R> from XAFS will be longer than the distance between lattice points measured by diffraction. It also means the temperature dependence of <R> may be different from that of L. This can be important if you want relate distances measured by XAFS to those measured by diffraction in systems with high thermal disorder (say, hot metals). And it is precisely because XAFS is sensitive to R alone. --Matt _______________________________________________ Ifeffit mailing list Ifeffit@millenia.cars.aps.anl.gov http://millenia.cars.aps.anl.gov/mailman/listinfo/ifeffit